[Auscope-geosciml] RE : GroundwaterML [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]

Stephen M Richard steve.richard at azgs.az.gov
Wed Sep 2 11:22:10 EDT 2009


Eric--your attached figure didn't make it.
steve


Boisvert, Eric wrote:
> Here the description we have
>  
> An excavation where the intended use is for location, acquisition, development, or artificial recharge of ground water.
>
> http://water.nv.gov/WaterPlanning/dict-1/PDFs/wwords-w.pdf
>
> A water well is an excavation or structure created in the ground ? by digging, driving, boring or drilling to access water in underground aquifers. 
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_well <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_well> 
>
>  
>
> The whole discussion was more around "is water well a role or a thing ?". Boyan rule of thumb is "role can change" and considering that a borehole can stop being a water well, it might be a role.
>  
> some element of the discussion came from the Australian groundwater model, see figure 3.1a and 3.1b - these are places you can draw water from
> http://www.brs.gov.au/land&water/groundwater/fundamental.html#2
>  
> Now, if it's a role, and we can draw groundwater from several features, we came up with the model where a Water well is a point where groundwater is extracted from some other feature.
> The figure attached shows a WaterWell that has a relation (groundwaterAccessFeature) to any feature
> I think it's a case where we went too 'conceptual'.  While the model is conceptually right (maybe), it is not practical (If we have to explain it at length to people who are knowledgeable in both UML and geology, it must fail the laugh test)
>  
> My intention (and it's Wednesday) is to revert to WaterWell as a subtype of Borehole.
>  
> Eric
>  
>  
>
> ________________________________
>
> De: auscope-geosciml-bounces at lists.arcs.org.au de la part de Simon Cox
> Date: mer. 2009-09-02 02:17
> À: auscope-geosciml at lists.arcs.org.au
> Cc: piotr.wojda at jrc.ec.europa.eu
> Objet : Re: [Auscope-geosciml] GroundwaterML [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
>
>
>
> A borehole samples an acquifer (reservoir).
> Water (oil) is transported away from the top of a borehole.
> If you are interested in the details of which molecule came from where, then
> the curve-feature is your thing.
> If you are interested in the quantities produced from some site, then the
> point feature whose location corresponds with one end of the curve is your
> thing.
> They may share some properties.
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------
> Simon Cox
>
> European Commission, Joint Research Centre,
> Institute for Environment and Sustainability,
> Spatial Data Infrastructures Unit, TP 262
> Via E. Fermi, 2749, I-21027 Ispra (VA), Italy
> Tel: +39 0332 78 3652
> Fax: +39 0332 78 6325
> mailto:simon.cox at jrc.ec.europa.eu
> http://ies.jrc.ec.europa.eu/simon-cox
>
> SDI Unit: http://sdi.jrc.ec.europa.eu/
> IES Institute: http://ies.jrc.ec.europa.eu/
> JRC: http://www.jrc.ec.europa.eu/
> --------------------------------------------------------
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: auscope-geosciml-bounces at lists.arcs.org.au
> [mailto:auscope-geosciml-bounces at lists.arcs.org.au] On Behalf Of
> Oliver.Raymond at ga.gov.au
> Sent: Wednesday, 2 September 2009 08:04
> To: auscope-geosciml at lists.arcs.org.au
> Cc: piotr.wojda at jrc.ec.europa.eu
> Subject: Re: [Auscope-geosciml] GroundwaterML [SEC=UNCLASSIFIED]
>
> Hi Eric,
>
> I think it's still Tuesday in Canada right now, so I can support your option
> 1  :)
>
> 1.  Re well/borehole in GWML, it's not consistent that a water well is a
> specialisation of SamplingPoint, but it has all the associated attributes of
> a GSML:Borehole (a SamplingCurve specialisation).  Being a SamplingPoint
> implies there is no length to a well and you are only describing the collar
> location, but WaterWell has association to a well log which indicates
> length.
>
> To me, this suggests that a GWML:WaterWell is a borehole in all aspects of
> GWML other than not actually being a specialisation of GSML:Borehole.
>
> Could you give an example of when a WaterWell is not a borehole.... perhaps
> when WaterWell/wellDevelopment/Process = "pick and shovel"?
>
> I agree with Bruce, some of the WaterWell descriptors could definitely be
> added to GSML:Borehole.
>
> 2.  GWML is not the only place that needs "a good pattern for geochemistry
> (assays)".  I have played with various options at GA in preparation for our
> inorganic geochemistry and geochronology databases going to WFS.  I'll get
> together what I've done to date and send it around.
>
> Cheers,
> Ollie
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Boisvert, Eric [mailto:Eric.Boisvert at RNCan-NRCan.gc.ca]
> Sent: Tuesday, 1 September 2009 7:25 PM
> To: Bruce.Simons at dpi.vic.gov.au; Guillaume.Duclaux at csiro.au; Percival Dale;
> Raymond Oliver
> Cc: piotr.wojda at jrc.ec.europa.eu
> Subject: RE : GroundwaterML
>
>
> there was a epic discussion about "is a WaterWell a Borehole or not".  A
> discussion Pitor Wodja, Jean Brodeur and Boyan Brodaric were part of.
> I think in this model, it's not a borehole, but another SamplingFeature.
> Wells are not always borehole, it's just a feature from which we draw water.
> Sometimes, we draw water from boreholes.  We had intense discussion trying
> to figure if we saw two features (A well and a borehole) or just one which
> is a subtype.
>
> One side of the discussion says it's ludicrous, wells are virtually alway
> always boreholes and for all practical purposes, other kinds of wells can be
> regarded as such.
> The other side claim that Well is a role of a borehole and we should grant
> this role to whatever feature we can draw water from (The Australian
> groundwater model, circa 1999, lists a series, Piotr also has a couple of
> examples from Belgium).
>
> I will defend point of view #1 of Mondays and Tuesdays, during full moon,
> and during Winter Carnaval.
> And will defend #2 when I drank Bordeau wine, when there are not too much
> snow to shovel and when the kids are calm (it's a common saying in Quebec to
> say that kids can predict snow storm).
> I will shoo the discussion in any other situation.
>
> What GWML needs now (and maybe ResourceML and GeoSciML) is a good pattern
> for geoschemistry (assays).  yes, it's O&M, but there are a lots of way to
> encode the same thing in O&M
>
> Eric
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> De: Bruce.Simons at dpi.vic.gov.au [mailto:Bruce.Simons at dpi.vic.gov.au]
> Date: lun. 2009-08-31 21:45
> À: Guillaume.Duclaux at csiro.au; Dale.Percival at ga.gov.au;
> Oliver.Raymond at ga.gov.au
> Cc: Boisvert, Eric
> Objet : GroundwaterML
>
>
>
> Hi guys
> Eric Boisvert has extended the Borehole model to cover WaterWells. It is
> documented at:
> GWML is here (version 1 that will soon undergo revision for a v.2 following
> GeoSciML evolution)
> http://ngwd-bdnes.cits.nrcan.gc.ca/service/api_ngwds/en/gwml.html
> <http://ngwd-bdnes.cits.nrcan.gc.ca/service/api_ngwds/en/gwml.html>
>
> A quick look suggests some of the WaterWekll properties are probably
> applicable to Mineral and Petroleum Bores as well(!).(eg wellDepth, status
> etc).
> As part of the modelling F2F meetingshould we be looking at reconciling the
> GWML and GeoSciML Borehole/WaterWell properties?
>
> Cheers
> Bruce
>
> GeoScience Victoria
> EARTH RESOURCES DIVISION
> Department of Primary Industries
> Melbourne, Victoria
> AUSTRALIA
> Ph: +61-3-9658 4502
> Fax: +61-3-9658 4555
> Mobile: +61 429 177155
> ----- Forwarded by Bruce Simons/DPI/VICGOV1 on 01/09/2009 11:41 AM -----
>
> "Boisvert, Eric" <Eric.Boisvert at RNCan-NRCan.gc.ca>
>
> 31/08/2009 11:00 PM
>
> To
> <Bruce.Simons at dpi.vic.gov.au>
> cc
> Subject
> RE: Quebec Face to Face - Show of hands - logistic
>
>
>
>
>
>
> beer probably won't be available for lunch, but there are plenty of watering
> holes around and beer and wine can be bought in convenience stores (7-11
> kind of stores) in this province, and bar closes at 3 am.  You don't want to
> test Quebec wine..
>
> GWML is here (version 1 that will soon undergo revision for a v.2 following
> GeoSciML evolution)
> http://ngwd-bdnes.cits.nrcan.gc.ca/service/api_ngwds/en/gwml.html
> <http://ngwd-bdnes.cits.nrcan.gc.ca/service/api_ngwds/en/gwml.html>
>
> Eric
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> De : Bruce.Simons at dpi.vic.gov.au [mailto:Bruce.Simons at dpi.vic.gov.au]
> Envoyé : 31 août 2009 08:54
> À : Boisvert, Eric
> Objet : Re: Quebec Face to Face - Show of hands - logistic
>
>
> Lunch boxes good idea - no special requirements apart from wine and beer PS
> can you send a link to the GroundwaterMl websites?
> Bruce
>
> GeoScience Victoria
> EARTH RESOURCES DIVISION
> Department of Primary Industries
> Melbourne, Victoria
> AUSTRALIA
> Ph: +61-3-9658 4502
> Fax: +61-3-9658 4555
> Mobile: +61 429 177155
>
>
> "Boisvert, Eric" <Eric.Boisvert at RNCan-NRCan.gc.ca>
>
> 31/08/2009 10:35 PM
>
>
>
> To
> <ssankaran at esri.com>, <Alistair.Ritchie at dpi.vic.gov.au>, "Boisvert, Eric"
> <Eric.Boisvert at RNCan-NRCan.gc.ca>, <Bruce.Simons at dpi.vic.gov.au>,
> <Carlo.Cipolloni at apat.it>, <Dale.Percival at ga.gov.au>, "Dohar, Vic"
> <Vic.Dohar at NRCan-RNCan.gc.ca>, <trd at bgs.ac.uk>, "Fernando Perez Cerdan"
> <f.perez at igme.es>, "Janjou Dominique" <d.janjou at brgm.fr>, "joel bandibas"
> <joel.bandibas at aist.go.jp>, "Julien, Heryk"
> <Heryk.Julien at RNCan-NRCan.gc.ca>, Lars-Kristian Stölen
> <Lars.Kristian.Stolen at sgu.se>, "Laxton, John L" <jll at bgs.ac.uk>,
> <Oliver.Raymond at ga.gov.au>, "Pen, S.J. (Simon)" <Simon.Pen at tno.nl>, "Rupert,
> James" <James.Rupert at NRCan-RNCan.gc.ca>, "Ryan Clark"
> <ryan.clark.j at gmail.com>, "Serrano Jean-Jacques" <jj.serrano at brgm.fr>,
> <steve.richard at azgs.az.gov>, "Tellez-Arenas Agnes"
> <a.tellez-arenas at brgm.fr>, "Vuollo Jouni" <jouni.vuollo at gtk.fi> cc Subject
> Quebec Face to Face - Show of hands - logistic
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 3 weeks to go..
>
> Do we want to repeat Uppsala lunch boxes idea ?  I understand we might have
> a lot of ground to cover in 4.5 days.
> There must be 100 restaurants within 4 blocks around our office, so choice
> is not a problem, but it obviously takes more time.
>
> If we go lunch box - any one has food restrictions we should be aware of ?
> We can provide receipts for those who needs them.
>
> Eric
>
> ================================================================
> Eric Boisvert
> Spécialiste TI-GI / IT-IM specialist
> Eric.Boisvert at rncan.gc.ca, 418-654-3705, facsimile/télécopieur
> 418-654-2615
> 490, rue de la Couronne, Québec (Québec), G1K 9A9 490, rue de la Couronne,
> Quebec, Quebec, G1K 9A9
>
> Laboratoire de cartographie numérique et de photogrammétrie (LCNP) Digital
> Cartography and Photogrammetry Laboratory (DCPL) Commission géologique du
> Canada (Québec) / Geological Survey of Canada (Quebec) Ressources naturelles
> Canada / Natural Resources Canada Gouvernement du Canada / Government of
> Canada http://cgc.rncan.gc.ca/org/quebec <http://cgc.rncan.gc.ca/org/quebec>
> http://cgc.rncan.gc.ca/dir/index_f.php?id=4186
> <http://cgc.rncan.gc.ca/dir/index_f.php?id=4186>  /
> http://cgc.rncan.gc.ca/dir/index_e.php?id=4186
> <http://cgc.rncan.gc.ca/dir/index_e.php?id=4186>
>
>
>
>
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-- 
Stephen M. Richard
Section Chief, Geoinformatics
Arizona Geological Survey
416 W. Congress St., #100
Tucson, Arizona, 85701 USA

Phone: 
Office: (520) 209-4127
Reception: (520) 770-3500 
FAX: (520) 770-3505

email: steve.richard at azgs.az.gov

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